The CRAN Archives -- March 1998
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Mon Mar 2 01:25:01 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id BAA13451; Mon, 2 Mar 1998 01:25:01 -0700 (MST)
Received: from vcn.bc.ca (oberon@opus.vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id BAA13427; Mon, 2 Mar 1998 01:24:59 -0700 (MST)
X-Authentication-Warning: listservice.net: Host oberon@opus.vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2] claimed to be vcn.bc.ca
Received: from localhost (oberon@localhost)
by vcn.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA12272
for ; Mon, 2 Mar 1998 00:24:59 -0800 (PST)
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 00:24:59 -0800 (PST)
From: Doug Skrecky
To: cran@listservice.net
Subject: (fwd) Your Expensive Urine--- Ahem
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
From: sbharris@ix.netcom.com(Steven B. Harris)
Newsgroups: sci.life-extension,sci.med.nutrition,misc.health.alternative,sci.med,sci.med.pharmacy
A trial published in the Lancet several years ago called the
Cambridge Heart Antioxidant Supplement (CHAOS) trial showed that
megadose vitamin E was about as effective as aspirin at
preventing a heart attack in subjects at special risk for one.
At that time there was very little comment on the fact that this,
and earlier results on vitamin E and peripheral vascular disease,
as well as one monkey experiment proving pathologically vitamin
E's interference with diet induced atherogenesis, had all gone a
long way toward vindicating the Shute brothers (Canadian
physicians who had claimed that vitamin E was good for heart
disease), and many others whom the FDA had been calling quacks
for years. Wups. Very occasionally the government is wrong.
Hey, it happens.
But we were assured that vitamin E was a fluke. If you took
those devil vitamins from the quacks, so said Dr. Victor Herbert,
you could be sure at least the water soluble vitamins were just
giving you expensive urine. Nothing more.
But then came the annoying evidence regarding homocysteine as
a risk factor for coronary disease, and also the fact that
homocysteine levels are lowered by supplements of folate and B6.
And there were some very odd monkey studies showing regression of
atherosclerosis with B6 supplementation also. Did it happen with
humans?
So far, all we have is epidemiology, but it's epidemiology
that all points in one direction. Just this month come two
studies, one published in Feb 10, 98 _Circulation_, the other in
The Feb 4 _Journal of the Canadian Medical Association._ The
latter study looks at the 80,000 woman enrolled in the Nurse's
Health Study, who have been followed prospectively for more than
15 years. The study found that for every 200 ug of folate
consumed, a woman's heart disease risk fell by 11%, and for every
2 mg increase in B6, it fell by 17%-- in both cases controlling
for all other known risks. The study estimated that the risk for
women getting at least twice the RDA of both vitamins, with or
without supplements, was less than half that of women getting the
RDA (who are rare enough without supplements).
A second, this time multinational, study (the European
Concerted Action Project) reported in Circulation (97: 437-43,
1998) found that men and women not getting the RDA of B6 had
almost twice the stroke and heart disease risk of those getting
RDA levels (this was a case control study, with 750 people with
diseases compared with 800 matched controls). Interestingly the
increased risk was partly independent of homocysteine levels,
suggesting an independent role for B6 in protection from stroke
and heart attack (possibly an antithrombotic one, suggests this
article).
All of this was both good and bad news for the FDA, which for
15 years had fought the idea of supplementing diets with folate
for purposes of prevention of birth defects, right up until the
time it decided to mandate the addition of folate to flour
products, which began on Jan. 1 of this year. Zo now you haff no
choize. You vill eat ziss folate supplement, UNT you vill like
it. But people who sell B6 pills are still vitamin huckster
quacks. Or will be, until B6 also becomes a flour fortification
vitamin in the future. And maybe even after. Vitamins in pills,
bad. Quack, quack. Vitamins removed in processing, and then
re-added to foods by food industry, good. Got it? Never mind
your expensive urine. That only confuses things.
Steve Harris, M.D.
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 5 09:59:40 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id JAA00392; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 09:59:40 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id JAA00152; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 09:59:06 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA13295;
Thu, 5 Mar 1998 11:58:17 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA09558;
Thu, 5 Mar 1998 11:57:18 -0500 (EST)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 11:57:18 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Appetite versus Hunger -- Manipulating the Drive to Eat
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
My greatest difficulty in practicing CRAN is not with hunger, but
with appetite. I can do a fairly good job of avoiding eating despite
hunger pangs, but I find I have a great deal of difficulty ceasing to eat
once I have started. One way of dealing with this has been by weighing and
rationing the amount of food I eat. Another way might be to eat very
infrequently. I have not done this, however, because of my desire to take
nutritional supplements with food and my desire to take those supplements
3 times daily (8am, 4pm, midnight).
One thing I have noticed about appetite -- or, at least, my appetite
under the normal circumstance of usually being somewhat hungry or having a
desire to eat -- is that almost anything I eat piques my appetite for more
of what I have just eaten. Knowing this, I try to force myself to eat
things like cabbage & cucumber when I am giving-in to the desire to eat.
Although I often would prefer to be eating something other than these very
low-calorie foods, once I begin eating them, my appetite re-focuses toward
eating more of the same. I think this has been an effective technique in
reducing my overall calorie intake.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 5 10:15:36 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id KAA06830; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 10:15:36 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id KAA05449; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 10:11:14 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA14718;
Thu, 5 Mar 1998 12:06:44 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA10151;
Thu, 5 Mar 1998 12:05:45 -0500 (EST)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 12:05:44 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological studies
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
An important part of my practice of CRAN has been keeping my total
fat intake to less than 10% of my total calories. I have just been
studying two articles on the issue of dietary fat in the NEW ENGLAND
JOURNAL OF MEDICINE which, together, go a long way toward explaining the
issues of the complex subject of dietary fat. One is the massive (80,082
women, 14-year) Nurses' Health Study review of dietary fat
[NEJM 337(21):1491-1499 (1997)]. The other is a clinical debate on the benefits
of a diet relatively low in fat and high in carbohydrate
[NEJM 337(8):562-567 (1997)].
I found the effort to account for confounding factors in the Nurses'
Health Study to be particularly interesting. Four categories of fats were
studied: (1) saturated fat (2) mono-saturated fat (3) poly-unsaturated
fat and (4) trans unsaturated fat. Levels of intake for all four types
were divided into 3 categories of: (1) lowest (2) intermediate
(3) highest.
For all categories of fat, fat intake was inversely related to
vigorous exercise. This is probably due to the psychological phenomenon of
people who exercise eating more fruits, vegetables, grains & legumes as
part of a healthy lifestyle. Fat intake was also inversely related to
Vitamin E supplementation for all categories of fat except
poly-unsaturated fat (for which there was no correlation between fat
intake and supplementation). Again, this probably indicates the healthy
lifestyle psychology of taking Vitamin E along with eating less fatty
foods -- and substituting polyunsaturated fats for saturated fats.
Fat intake also varied inversely with alcohol intake for all
categories of fat. This is *not* an indicator of a healthy lifestyle. More
likely, it indicates a homeostatic reduction in calories from fat to
compensate for increased calories from alcohol. This may explain the
"French Paradox" of low incidence of coronary heart disease in France if
high alcohol consumption mean fewer fats are being ingested. However, I
don't drink alcohol and I think there are better alternatives to
fat-calories than alcohol-calories. (The Honolulu Heart Study found a
direct correlation between incidence of stroke and all levels of alcohol
consumption -- in contrast to other studies which showed benefit to
"moderate" alcohol consumption. There are probably many confounding
factors in these epidemiological studies which have yet to be defined.
Often, I find that the category of "non-drinker" includes former
alcoholics -- which creates a bias for the advantages of "moderate
drinking".)
Fat intake varied directly with smoking for all categories of fat
except poly-unsaturated fat. This makes some sense from the "healthy
lifestyle" point of view, since smokers would be less health conscious and
less likely to be concerned about eating fatty foods -- or substituting
poly-unsaturated fats for saturated fats. But since smokers are
notoriously lean, it surprises me that they consume more fat. Adjusting
for smoking proved to be crucial for the Nurses' Health Study. Without
adjustment, total fat intake would be significantly associated with
increased incidence of coronary heart disease. But adjusting for smoking,
there is virtually no association between total fat intake and CHD.
CHD relative risk for each increase of 5% relative calories for each
kind of fat is 1.17, 0.81 and 0.62 for saturated, mono-unsaturated and
poly-unsaturated fat, respectively. This would seem to indicate that the
less the saturation of the fat, the better for preventing coronary heart
disease. But in the discussion section of the Nurses' Health Study paper
it is noted that total mortality varies inversely with mono-unsaturated
fat consumption.
In the clinical debate paper the association between poly-unsaturated
fats & cancer from animal studies is noted, and a recommendation is made
to substitute mono-unsaturated for poly-unsaturated fats. Human
epidemiological studies (as I interpret the paper's description) indicate
the greatest risk for colon cancer may be from red meat, rather than from
total fat. The risk factor for prostate cancer is associated with animal
fat rather than total fat. I suspect that there may be many confounding
factors involved in these observations which have yet to be elucidated.
(No mention is ever made of the higher pesticide/industrial toxin content
of animal fats.)
Although the Nurses' Health Study would indicate no benefit for
coronary heart disease by substituting carbohydrates for fat, the clinical
debate shed a lot more light on this question. It was noted that dietary
fat intake has dropped since 1976 while obesity has increased by
one-third. This doesn't surprise me too much insofar as most of the "low
fat" foods I see in stores are loaded with sugar. For me, a low-fat diet
means a diet in which most calories come from protein or the complex
carbohydrates of vegetables (not even the complex carbohydrates of
"starchy foods" -- I avoid pasta and ration bread).
The strongest anti-carbohydrate argument I see in the debate is that
low fat/high carbohydrate diets lower HDL cholesterol along with lowering
LDL cholesterol -- whether the carbohydrate is sugar or starch (complex
carbohydrate). Such a diet also reduces the intake of dietary Vitamin E.
Vitamin E (including gamma-tocopherol) can be gotten from supplements
without the need to eat fat. The debate paper also mentions the fact that
epidemiological studies of Chinese has shown that for people who are lean
and active, HDL cholesterol is not lowered.
I have ample reason to believe that my < 10% fat intake and my
practice of CRAN have dramatically improved my HDL/LDL ratio. Although my
level of exercise has not changed in 10 years (I do vigorous exercise
about 3 times weekly -- and exercise increases HDL cholesterol), from my
1993 physical exam to my 1997 exam my weight dropped from 150 to 112
pounds while my LDL cholesterol dropped from 2.41 to 1.31 mmol/Litre and
my HDL cholesterol rose from 1.20 to 1.52 mmol/L.
My overall conclusion is that a very low fat intake in the context of
a low-calorie diet, exercise and good supplements is a very effective
strategy for reducing the risk of death due to heart disease, cancer and
"aging".
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 5 16:07:34 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id QAA25773; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 16:07:34 -0700 (MST)
Received: from monsoon.dial.pipex.net (monsoon.dial.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id QAA25728; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 16:07:28 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199803052307.QAA25728@listservice.net>
Received: (qmail 19548 invoked from network); 5 Mar 1998 23:07:29 -0000
Received: from userb705.uk.uudial.com (HELO yz34.dial.pipex.com) (193.149.83.180)
by smtp.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 1998 23:07:29 -0000
From: "Phil Harris"
To: "Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver"
Subject: Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological studies
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 22:52:48 -0000
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
SNIP
> My overall conclusion is that a very low fat intake in the context of
> a low-calorie diet, exercise and good supplements is a very effective
> strategy for reducing the risk of death due to heart disease, cancer and
> "aging".
>
> --------------------------------------------
> Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
> http://www.benbest.com/
A very useful posting. Perhaps your plant product intake will also have
protective effects in its own right. All I can add further is that the
conclusions that you cull from these studies appear very similar to those
appearing from the Cornell China Project, even though most of the Chinese
population(s) have diet and physiology profiles displaced to the 'healthy'
end of our spectrum. (We and they need to worry about different diseases).
Even in the different Chinese context, however, surprisingly small intakes
of animal products still apparently make an unfavourable difference to
cancer incidence, even in a leaner population with otherwise useful
physiological characteristics, such as the lower cholesterol levels, which
in the West you do not usually see unless you are doing CR.
Of course the Chinese are not doing CRAN or even plain CR. Despite low BMI
they average 2800 calories a day. I was surprised by this figure.
Although, apparently, Westerners have cut back calories intake on average
to around 2400 because of less physical work, there is more obesity in our
populations than there used to be.
best wishes
Phil Harris
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 5 16:57:35 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id QAA14502; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 16:57:35 -0700 (MST)
Received: from proxy3.ba.best.com (root@proxy3.ba.best.com [206.184.139.14]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id QAA14491; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 16:57:34 -0700 (MST)
Received: from infoscreen.com (timothy.vip.best.com [206.86.94.206]) by proxy3.ba.best.com (8.8.8/8.8.BEST) with SMTP id PAA03792; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 15:53:34 -0800 (PST)
Received: (from tim@localhost) by infoscreen.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA00335; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 16:51:45 -0800
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 16:51:45 -0800
From: Tim Freeman
Message-Id: <199803060051.QAA00335@infoscreen.com>
To: Phil.Harris@dial.pipex.com
CC: CRAN@ListService.net, tim@infoscreen.com
In-reply-to: <199803052307.QAA25728@listservice.net> (Phil.Harris@dial.pipex.com)
Subject: Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological studies
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
>Even in the different Chinese context, however, surprisingly small intakes
>of animal products still apparently make an unfavourable difference to
>cancer incidence, even in a leaner population with otherwise useful
>physiological characteristics, such as the lower cholesterol levels, which
>in the West you do not usually see unless you are doing CR.
How small? Every meal I eat has a small piece of fish, about 100 grams.
--
Tim Freeman
tim@infoscreen.com http://www.infoscreen.com/resume.html
Web-centered Java, Perl, and C++ programming in Silicon Valley or offsite
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 5 21:29:15 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id VAA20428; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 21:29:15 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id VAA20423; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 21:29:14 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA01524;
Thu, 5 Mar 1998 23:29:17 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA22522;
Thu, 5 Mar 1998 23:28:17 -0500 (EST)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 1998 23:28:17 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological studies
In-Reply-To: <199803060051.QAA00335@infoscreen.com>
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Thu, 5 Mar 1998, Tim Freeman wrote:
> >Even in the different Chinese context, however, surprisingly small intakes
> >of animal products still apparently make an unfavourable difference to
> >cancer incidence, even in a leaner population with otherwise useful
> >physiological characteristics, such as the lower cholesterol levels, which
> >in the West you do not usually see unless you are doing CR.
>
> How small? Every meal I eat has a small piece of fish, about 100 grams.
Fish products are not included in "animal products". Fish oils are
actually often protective against cardiovascular disease because they
are high in omega-3 fatty acids, which lower blood triglycerides. But
the main benefit of omega-3 fatty acids is as a precursor of
prostaglandin, which inhibits platelet aggregation and dilates blood
vessels. Linseed (flaxseed) oil, however, is a richer source of
omega-3 fatty acid (55% linoleic acid) than fish.
There is a downside to omega-3 fatty acids, however. The inhibition
of clotting may be dangerous in leading to excessive bleeding. Omega-3
oils in large doses depress the immune system and have been associated
with scarring of heart muscle in animal studies.
The amount of essential fatty acid (mainly linoleic acid) which
is required in the diet is very small. I periodically take a linseed
oil capsule or other essential fatty acid supplement, and don't much
worry about the matter besides that. My main focus is to reduce fat
intake as much as possible -- to reduce calories. Animal fats, besides
being saturated, are probably higher in pesticides and environmental
organotoxins (like dioxin). The food chain in the ocean probably does
not contain so many pesticides.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Fri Mar 6 03:31:22 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id DAA10549; Fri, 6 Mar 1998 03:31:22 -0700 (MST)
Received: from monsoon.dial.pipex.net (monsoon.dial.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id DAA10540; Fri, 6 Mar 1998 03:31:17 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199803061031.DAA10540@listservice.net>
Received: (qmail 17330 invoked from network); 6 Mar 1998 10:31:13 -0000
Received: from usera212.uk.uudial.com (HELO yz34.dial.pipex.com) (193.149.65.212)
by smtp.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 6 Mar 1998 10:31:13 -0000
From: "Phil Harris"
To: "Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver"
Subject: RE- Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 10:19:07 -0000
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
(APOLOGIES to TIM. I did it again and sent to him first by mistake.)
----------
> From: Tim Freeman
> Subject: Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological
studies
> Date: 06 March 1998 00:51
>
>>Even in the different Chinese context, however, surprisingly small
>>intakes
>>of animal products still apparently make an unfavourable difference to
>> cancer incidence, even in a leaner population with otherwise useful
>> physiological characteristics, such as the lower cholesterol levels,
>>which
>>in the West you do not usually see unless you are doing CR.
>
> How small? Every meal I eat has a small piece of fish, about 100 grams.
> --
> Tim Freeman
My piece was taken from what I have read of T C Campbell's work.
I can only quote snippets from the web site for Campbell and the China
Project. >http:www.mcspotlight.org/media/reports/campbell_china2.html<
There is a 1991 paper as well.
However when one unpacks the reports a little we see changes in development
eg onset of menarch, and changes to mortality from virally caused liver
cancer and other such specifics, which influence the headline figures.
I am not at all sure what your little bit of fish does within your CRAN
context. As I mentioned, though the Chinese have a diet closer to your CR
one and a BMI close to yours, they are certainly not doing CR.
BTW I do not think Campbell is claiming 'plasma cholesterol' is 'causal',
more a matter of being a useful biomarker.
Snippets follow. Hope they are not overlong.
Phil Harris
SNIPPET 1..
"In the final analysis, we have strong evidence from this and other studies
that nutrition becomes the controlling factor in the development of chronic
degenerative diseases," Campbell concludes.
"Even small intakes of animal foods, which simultaneously alter the intake
of countless nutrients and other constituents, is capable of significantly
elevating plasma cholesterol and similar biomarkers, and thereby elevate
the risk of degenerative diseases.
"Mere tinkering with our diets by consumption of a few low-fat foods or
special nutrient supplements, although possibly useful under some
circumstances, will likely only have minimally useful effects and almost
certainly will not be a panacea for disease prevention." Rather, he
stresses, Americans need to shift to a more plant-based diet.
The typical American diet contains 10 times more animal protein (as percent
of calories) than does the typical Chinese diet. The average dietary fat
intake in China is 15 percent of calories compared with 38 to 40 percent in
the United States. The average consumption of dietary fiber is 33 grams a
day in China compared with 10 to 12 grams in the United States.
AND..............SNIPPET 2
Although the biology of the diet and disease relationship is infinitely
complex and is easily misunderstood when interpreted in a reductionism
manner, the main nutritional conclusion from this study is the finding that
the greater the consumption of a variety of good quality plant-based foods,
the lower the risk of those diseases which are commonly found in western
countries (eg., cancers, cardiovascular diseases, diabetes). Based on these
and other data, we hypothesize that 80-90% of all such diseases could be
prevented before about age 90 years.
The optimum lifetime blood cholesterol concentration may be as low as
100-125 mg/dL (compared to an average concentration of about 210 mg/dL in
the US.).
The same dietary factors which increase blood cholesterol concentrations
among Americans (at the much higher ranges) also increase cholesterol at
the lower concentrations of the Chinese; these include, for example,
increased intakes of dietary fat and animal protein and decreased intakes
of dietary fiber and legumes. Moreover, the lower the blood cholesterol,
the lower the risk for various cancers; there is no evidence of a
cholesterol threshold below which further decreases in disease would not
occur. These two facts are quite remarkable, in that they suggest that
almost any consumption of animal-based foods (higher in fat, lower in
fiber) may increase blood cholesterol (among many other biochemical
changes) from a very low level, this to be followed by a significant
increase in the prevalence of the degenerative diseases (many other
analyses of these same data for individual diet-disease relationships
support this interpretation).
Chinese consume more total calories (per unit of body weight), yet have far
less obesity than AMericans, probably accounted for both by greater
physical activity and greater consumption of a low fat, plant-based diet.
chronic infection with hepatitis B virus is a major cause of primary liver
cancer. Together with the highly significant nutritional findings, this
cancer appears to be a viral/nutritional disease, not a viral/chemical
carcinogen disease as previously thought (our data on this question are
more comprehensive than all others combined, thus our conclusion on the
role of nutrition, even though different, is highly relevant). Control of
the prevalence of this disease may be best achieved through immunization of
young children. Prevention of disease progression among individuals who
suffer chronic hepatitis infection may be best achieved through strict
adherence to a low fat, plant based diet.
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Fri Mar 6 08:58:31 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id IAA09830; Fri, 6 Mar 1998 08:58:31 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id IAA09296; Fri, 6 Mar 1998 08:56:35 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA20307;
Fri, 6 Mar 1998 10:54:18 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA13760;
Fri, 6 Mar 1998 10:53:17 -0500 (EST)
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 10:53:17 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Carbohydrate binges
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
My main problem with binging has been with carbohydrates. For someone
else this might mean cookies, but for me it has meant the complex
carbohydrates in cooked grain foods, processed cereals and breads. I have
noticed that there is a whole syndrome to the binging process. It usually
occurs in the evening, often late at night when I am already very tired.
Perhaps my will power is weaker at that time, after a long day, and
usually I will have eaten very little during the day.
It may actually begin with a desire for fruit. I think I am slightly
hypoglycemic after a full day of few calories and on my way home I will
give in to the temptation to get some kiwi or a banana -- the desire
for some fruit-sugar. Bananas are high in tryptophan, so this may reduce
my alertness even more, preparing me for the binge.
Then I would eat some carbohydrate, either cereal (grape-nuts, shredded
wheat 'N bran or even oatmeal) or bread slices (often with cheese). Both
the glucose from carbohydrate and branch-chained amino acids (especially
leucine) increase insulin secretion. Insulin facilitates the transport
of branch-chained amino acids into muscle cells, thereby reducing the
competition tryptophan faces for the large neutral amino acid transporter
that takes it across the blood-brain barrier. Once in the brain,
virtually all tryptophan is converted to serotonin. Serotonin
concentration in the brain is far more sensitive to the effects of
diet than any other monoamine transmitter -- and can be increased up
to 10-fold by dietary supplementation in dietary animals.
The serotonin will make me painfully drowsy, and yet the elevated
insulin will aggrevate my appetite for more carbohydrate. In this
condition, I become like a drunk, whose will to resist drinking more
alcohol has been eroded by alcohol. Therefore, I continue to binge --
feeling sleepier and sleepier and yet more and more intent upon gratifying
my appetite.
In order to deal with this situation, I have resorted to rationing.
The only cereal I permit myself is a mix of wheat bran, oat bran and
FIBRE ONE with unflavored, sugar-free Metamucil (only the FIBRE ONE
has been cooked/processed). I generally eat this during the day, to
prevent hemorrhoids -- despite the fact that it makes me sleepy and
sometimes interferes with my ability to do work.
I am now resorting to rationing of bread -- no more than 4 slices
per day. I may have to be more careful about fruit as well -- especially
(again) bananas.
I rarely see anyone but myself discuss problems with binging. I don't
know whether this is because others don't restrict calories as severely
as I do, or because others are more ashamed, or because others are less
expressive, or what. But I find it hard to believe that I am the only one
with a problem in this area, and I hope that others will find it helpful
to benefit from some of my struggles, lessons and strategies to prevent
binging.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Sat Mar 7 06:38:39 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id GAA16998; Sat, 7 Mar 1998 06:38:39 -0700 (MST)
Received: from monsoon.dial.pipex.net (monsoon.dial.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id GAA16964; Sat, 7 Mar 1998 06:38:33 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199803071338.GAA16964@listservice.net>
Received: (qmail 28639 invoked from network); 7 Mar 1998 13:38:31 -0000
Received: from usera027.uk.uudial.com (HELO yz34.dial.pipex.com) (193.149.65.27)
by smtp.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 1998 13:38:31 -0000
From: "Phil Harris"
To: "Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver"
Subject: cancer addendum - Fat - simple conclusions from complex epidemiological
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 1998 13:26:11 -0000
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
For Ben's CRan list
( I will cross-post part of this message to crsoc)
Brian Chiko wrote on the CRsoc list
subject Diet and cancer
>Folks,
>Just found this web site, thought you might be interested.
>I'm planning to order a copy:
>http://www.aicr.org/report1.htm
This site advertises a report, whose main advice is eat a mainly
plant-based diet with low fat, low salt, no or low red meat, alcohol ditto.
The advisory team includes TC Campbell of the Cornell China Project and
Prof Philip James (Aberdeen, Scotland) who is adviser on food to the new UK
government.
It may be of interest that a sharp battle has just been fought in the UK
with victory for those who have a different scientific interpretation of
the data and, presumably, victory also for the meat interests. The above
report was given an official endorsement here last September from our
Health Dept and Minister. The latter had to intervene to get the
recommendation on eating less, if any, red meat, re-inserted in the UK
official presentation after officials had taken it out. He has since had to
back-track and a few days ago the recommendation was put back up to the old
pre-report level. One of the arguments used here was that the data was not
UK data and therefore could not apply here.
Beware political agendas, gentle food folks. We talk global policies.
Phil Harris
NB I am slightly frustrated that Ben's great synopsis of the fat
epidemiological data is not available on the other CR list.
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Sat Mar 7 19:48:05 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id TAA19626; Sat, 7 Mar 1998 19:48:05 -0700 (MST)
Received: from proxy3.ba.best.com (root@proxy3.ba.best.com [206.184.139.14]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id TAA19593; Sat, 7 Mar 1998 19:48:00 -0700 (MST)
Received: from infoscreen.com (timothy.vip.best.com [206.86.94.206]) by proxy3.ba.best.com (8.8.8/8.8.BEST) with SMTP id SAA11521; Sat, 7 Mar 1998 18:46:30 -0800 (PST)
Received: (from tim@localhost) by infoscreen.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA00204; Sat, 7 Mar 1998 19:44:41 -0800
Date: Sat, 7 Mar 1998 19:44:41 -0800
From: Tim Freeman
Message-Id: <199803080344.TAA00204@infoscreen.com>
To: benbest@benbest.com
CC: CRAN@ListService.net, tim@infoscreen.com
In-reply-to: (message from Ben Best on Fri, 6 Mar 1998 10:53:17 -0500 (EST))
Subject: Re: Carbohydrate binges
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
>But I find it hard to believe that I am the only one
>with a problem in this area, and I hope that others will find it helpful
>to benefit from some of my struggles, lessons and strategies to prevent
>binging.
I have a similar problem. It also happens in the evening for me, and
it also happens when I have eaten too little that day. It is usually
accompanied by a headache. Early during the headache, eating will
make it go away. If I let it persist for longer, eating makes it
better but doesn't quickly make it go away. I have measured my blood
sugar when this is happening and I don't think it's hypoglycemia.
For the time being I choose to believe that the headache is
symptomatic of something and making it go away is worthwhile.
I plan to stockpile some canned vegetables or legumes, and try
eating them instead in these circumstances. The goal is to eat
something that supplies enough calories to make the headache go away,
but not something that escalates the binge.
--
Tim Freeman
tim@infoscreen.com http://www.infoscreen.com/resume.html
Web-centered Java, Perl, and C++ programming in Silicon Valley or offsite
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Sun Mar 8 13:29:55 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id NAA19670; Sun, 8 Mar 1998 13:29:55 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id NAA19662; Sun, 8 Mar 1998 13:29:53 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA16775;
Sun, 8 Mar 1998 15:29:54 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA20932;
Sun, 8 Mar 1998 15:28:47 -0500 (EST)
Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 15:28:47 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: Carbohydrate binges
In-Reply-To: <006601bd49ac$8468b8a0$c3038f80@ariel>
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Sat, 7 Mar 1998, Michael Carmack wrote:
> My personal experience: rationing can make quite a difference. I bought a
> nice digital kitchen scale (for weighing food, that is--accurate to within 2
> grams) and the walford diet planner software almost as soon as I began CR.
> For about 4 months I weighed absolutely everything I ate, and figured out
> the next day's food the night before with the software. I found it was
> possible to handle 1600 calories/day without too much trouble, simply
> because I wouldn't be thinking "hey, I can probably eat this and it wouldn't
> be too bad". Instead, I knew every bit of food that I would be eating that
> day, and it was just a matter of deciding when to eat it. (FWIW, I found
> that eating less in the morning and more at night was more agreeable.)
>
> I've gradually become less dependent on the scale and software as I gotten a
> routine down, but I always have a *fixed* amount of food to eat each day.
> Right now I'm getting in the neighborhood of 2000 cal/day in order to
> maintain my weight (I was loosing weight way to quickly for a while there,
> at least by my personal assessment), but that which is above 1600 cal/day is
> largely "filler"--stuff that is calorie dense that I'll easily be able to
> throw out when I'm ready to lose weight again. But rationing is essential
> for me to accomplish this.
Most of what you say I could apply to myself. On my website is my
record of consumption for a month in which I consumed less than 1,400
calories per day. Once I went for a week on 500 calories per day. I have
been trying to "wean" myself from my digital scale, but I still use it
to make breakfast (weigh my broccoli & strawberries to be around 60
calorie).
Recording every calorie for every food eaten and calculating
the totals and staying within limits is an extremely valuable experience
which I think no CRAN practitioner should miss. It heightens awareness,
improves discipline and educates that practitioner concerning the calorie
content of foods most recently eaten. But it can also get to be a hassle,
and if I can maintain 120 pounds without weighing, I will do so.
I think an occasional binge is not the end of the world, but I still
dislike the erosion of will-power and the sense of being "out of control"
-- driven by impulse rather than by reason. I try to follow a binge with
a fast.
For example, I went to visit my parents and some
> old friends about 3 weeks ago, and was there for about 2 weeks. During that
> time I didn't I make any effort to ration my food, nor was I around a
> reliable scale so that I could keep track of my weight. As a result, I came
> back 3 lbs heavier! I was a little disappointed--felt like I was going
> backwards! Anyway, it taught me a lesson: don't go visit relatives again :)
I have had the same problem almost every time I have traveled for more
than a few days.
> Ok, what it really taught me was that it's important to ration food. And for
> me, that means really planning out what I'm going to eat *the day before*.
Hard to do when you are traveling, unless you take your food with you.
> Incidently, IMO you make it tough on yourself keeping cheese, bread, and
> cereal around the house, especially if you're not rationing.
I have been rationing cereal for a long time. My cereal mixes are
in pre-allocated portions in plastic cups covered with a plastic bag
(from buying veggies) wrapped with a rubber band. You evidently weren't
paying attention to my posting, because the whole purpose of it was
to describe a *problem* leading to binging -- and a *solution*, namely,
rationing.
> I've come up with some fantastically low calorie salad dressings (like 25
> calories per 1/4 cup) made out of pureed silken tofu and/or vegetable gums
> (guar and xanthan); if you're interested, I can try to write down the
> recipes (mostly now I just wing it). They really liven up veggies; I could
> honestly eat nothing but salads all day and never feel deprived!
OK, let's hear the recipies. What is "silken tofu". I have heard the
term, but don't understand what it means.
Actually, I'm not usually very interested in recipies. Practicing
CRAN means that my appetite is usually pretty sharp, and I don't need
to be making efforts to make things taste better. Almost anything I eat
already tastes good -- too good, perhaps. Also, eating raw vegetables
straight from my cutting-board is less hassle than having to mess with
recipies. However, I've had some guar gum sitting in my fridge for
ages, and I'm willing to experiment with it until it is used-up.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Sun Mar 8 19:18:39 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id TAA05893; Sun, 8 Mar 1998 19:18:39 -0700 (MST)
Received: from www.cedarnet.org (www.cedarnet.org [206.29.224.1]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id TAA05881; Sun, 8 Mar 1998 19:18:38 -0700 (MST)
Received: from compaq (ppp149034.usmo.com [206.27.149.34])
by www.cedarnet.org (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id UAA27559
for ; Sun, 8 Mar 1998 20:18:41 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id: <199803090218.UAA27559@www.cedarnet.org>
From: "Doug Younkin"
To: CRAN@ListService.net
Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 20:18:01 +0000
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
Subject: Re: Carbohydrate binges
In-reply-to:
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
> Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 10:53:17 -0500 (EST)
Ben,
This is one reason I do not adopt a low fat diet, especially during
CRAN, because with fat content of meals at around 20-25%, the
glycemic index of my meal is much lower and so the glucose and
insulin response I experience are very gradual and I do not have
rebound effects or cravings. By intentionally limiting consumption
during the day, you probably do drastically lower your glucose
levels. As soon as you eat carbohydrates, you blast your glucose up
like a step function, and the response of your insulin soon follows
likewise. Then as the insulin depletes your blood of glucose, you
may experience a crash and actually need a quick fix of carbs to
rescue your body from a hypoglycemic attack. This see-saw effect can
be quite powerful on cravings and moods. My suggestion is to try
raising your fat intake (seeds, nuts, nut butters, olives, canola oil
spreads are the ones I use) to 20-25% and see what happens to your
cravings. I still need to monitor my calorie intake because it is
easy to consume more than my allotment much more quickly, but the
satiation is much more evident with the higher fat intake too.
Doug Younkin
================================
> From: Ben Best
> To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
> Cc: Ben Best
> Subject: Carbohydrate binges
snip
> Perhaps my will power is weaker at that time, after a long day, and
> usually I will have eaten very little during the day.
>
> It may actually begin with a desire for fruit. I think I am slightly
> hypoglycemic after a full day of few calories
snip
> Both
> the glucose from carbohydrate and branch-chained amino acids (especially
> leucine) increase insulin secretion.
snip
> The serotonin will make me painfully drowsy, and yet the elevated
> insulin will aggrevate my appetite for more carbohydrate. In this
> condition, I become like a drunk, whose will to resist drinking more
> alcohol has been eroded by alcohol. Therefore, I continue to binge --
> feeling sleepier and sleepier and yet more and more intent upon gratifying
> my appetite.
>
> In order to deal with this situation, I have resorted to rationing.
> The only cereal I permit myself is a mix of wheat bran, oat bran and
> FIBRE ONE with unflavored, sugar-free Metamucil (only the FIBRE ONE
> has been cooked/processed). I generally eat this during the day, to
> prevent hemorrhoids -- despite the fact that it makes me sleepy and
> sometimes interferes with my ability to do work.
>
> I am now resorting to rationing of bread -- no more than 4 slices
> per day. I may have to be more careful about fruit as well -- especially
> (again) bananas.
snip
> --------------------------------------------
> Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
> http://www.benbest.com/
>
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Mon Mar 9 04:23:35 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id EAA09737; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 04:23:35 -0700 (MST)
Received: from monsoon.dial.pipex.net (monsoon.dial.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id EAA09729; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 04:23:32 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199803091123.EAA09729@listservice.net>
Received: (qmail 20768 invoked from network); 9 Mar 1998 11:23:11 -0000
Received: from userj757.uk.uudial.com (HELO yz34.dial.pipex.com) (194.69.110.96)
by smtp.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 1998 11:23:11 -0000
From: "Phil Harris"
To: "Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver"
Subject: re carbo binges
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 1998 11:22:02 -0000
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
I agree with Doug Younkin that high glycemic index food does not help
appetite control over the day. Or from day to day for that matter: There
seems some distinct carry over of appetite from the day before. I would
not, however, go as far as introducing higher fat content.
I have found that smaller meals 5 or 6 times per day that include usually
some lower GI food or are high fibre / pectin raw veg / fruit blends, make
a big difference. They seem to alter the psychology as well.
When I eat my now smaller breakfast I immediately experience sharply
increased appetite. This lasts from 10 to 20 minutes after the breakfast.
It is useful to remind myself during this short period that I will have
more in a little while. This instantaneous onset does not square with the
GI theory too well nor with the small intestine satiety response which is
supposed to be satisfied by some foods more than others. Or so I read.
Maybe I am not on such strict CR but the above was the only way I could
still lose weight once I got well below my set point. Incidentally, from
the appetite point of view it was much easier when I was doing only raw
food for a while.
Phil Harris
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Mon Mar 9 10:23:50 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id KAA26213; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 10:23:50 -0700 (MST)
Received: from milestone.koan.de (root@milestone.koan.de [195.4.16.2]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id KAA26169; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 10:23:45 -0700 (MST)
Received: from rdf2z (ppp17.koan.de [195.4.16.37]) by milestone.koan.de (8.8.5/8.8.0) with SMTP id SAA13402 for ; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 18:19:40 -0100
Message-ID: <35042540.4867@koan.de>
Date: Mon, 09 Mar 1998 18:22:08 +0100
From: Richard & Dawn Fedorowicz
Reply-To: rdf2z@koan.de
Organization: All Fired Up
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: CRAN@ListService.net
Subject: Re: Carbohydrate binges
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
> I rarely see anyone but myself discuss problems with binging. I don't
> know whether this is because others don't restrict calories as severely
> as I do, or because others are more ashamed, or because others are less
> expressive, or what. But I find it hard to believe that I am the only one
> with a problem in this area, and I hope that others will find it helpful
> to benefit from some of my struggles, lessons and strategies to prevent
> binging.
>
Thanks for your openess and honesty, Ben. I would never have posted
anything about my own struggles with alcohol for fear of being scoffed
at - by a group of people who seem to have knowledge and willpower way
beyond my own!
Regards,
Dawn
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Mon Mar 9 11:06:09 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id LAA13806; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 11:06:09 -0700 (MST)
Received: from milestone.koan.de (root@milestone.koan.de [195.4.16.2]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id LAA13463; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 11:05:34 -0700 (MST)
Received: from rdf2z (ppp11.koan.de [195.4.16.31]) by milestone.koan.de (8.8.5/8.8.0) with SMTP id TAA13818 for ; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 19:01:44 -0100
Message-ID: <35042E50.659@koan.de>
Date: Mon, 09 Mar 1998 19:00:48 +0100
From: Richard & Dawn Fedorowicz
Reply-To: rdf2z@koan.de
Organization: All Fired Up
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: CRAN@ListService.net
Subject: Re: Appetite versus Hunger -- Manipulating the Drive to Eat...or Drink!
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Ben's posting was really interesting: I found eating small meals very
frequently helps me, eating a little even when not especially hungry
seems to prevent me wanting to 'go overboard'.
I have a different problem: when socialising I find it difficult to
restrain my drinking. My husband drinks at home in the evenings and
weekends, is very slim and sees no reason to alter his behaviour to help
me along. It's not possible to avoid socialising: our lifestyle demands
that we frequently attend functions. I've tried giving up drink
altogether and enjoying mineral water (which was refreshing and helped
keep my head clear!) but when all around you....and so on. So often we
get together with friends and colleagues for formal functions which I
feel anxious about - I'm shy and rather nervous, but it's not conducive
to good manners when meeting people, so I resort to Dutch Courage!
Any ideas on coping with this? Someone out there must have experienced
something similar...?
Dawn
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Mon Mar 9 15:32:27 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id PAA29236; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 15:32:27 -0700 (MST)
Received: from milestone.koan.de (root@milestone.koan.de [195.4.16.2]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id PAA29200; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 15:32:23 -0700 (MST)
Received: from rdf2z (ppp11.koan.de [195.4.16.31]) by milestone.koan.de (8.8.5/8.8.0) with SMTP id XAA17350 for ; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 23:28:25 -0100
Message-ID: <3504357E.2C00@koan.de>
Date: Mon, 09 Mar 1998 19:31:26 +0100
From: Richard & Dawn Fedorowicz
Reply-To: rdf2z@koan.de
Organization: All Fired Up
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: CRAN@ListService.net
Subject: RE- Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological
References: <199803061031.DAA10540@listservice.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Phil, I found your last post particularly interesting. I can't help
noticing how all the Chinese women in this regions are very, very
slender. I've never seen a fat Chinesewoman anyway!
One of the girls at our local restaurant says she eats two huge meals a
day, they are big family get-togethers and last for ages, and she never
counts calories (laughed at me eating a low fat diet!) but doesn't eat
much meat. Most of her family live to between their late eighties and
mid to late nineties. They are very healthy and put it down to their
traditional fare.
Dawn
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Mon Mar 9 15:43:44 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id PAA04360; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 15:43:44 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id PAA04354; Mon, 9 Mar 1998 15:43:42 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA23483;
Mon, 9 Mar 1998 17:43:41 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA23896;
Mon, 9 Mar 1998 17:42:31 -0500 (EST)
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 1998 17:42:31 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Mori-Nu Tofu
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Mori-Nu Lite & Mori-Nu Extra-Firm claim to be the lowest-fat tofu in
the world. Their product is packaged in asceptic packaging which is
hermetically sealed so that it need not be refrigerated before opening. It
can be ordered directly from the company and is shipped by UPS, when
ordered by the case.
Their website is at: www.morinu.com/welcome.html
Their e-mail address is: mori-nu@pacbell.net
Their phone number is: 1-800-669-8639 (1-800-NOW-TOFU)
Unfortunately, this number is not reachable from Canada and the
company does not ship to Canada except through their Canadian distributer
in Vancouver -- Sunrise Market at (604) 254-8888.
The Tofu actually has quite a bland taste -- moreso than most tofu's,
but this may be because of the low fat. I prefer the Extra Firm and am
trying to arrange an order through Sunrise Market. Tofu is a popular
substitute for milk, but I am more interested in the phytochemicals,
which have a good reputation for anti-cancerous properties.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Tue Mar 10 15:28:35 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id PAA09884; Tue, 10 Mar 1998 15:28:35 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id PAA09779; Tue, 10 Mar 1998 15:28:18 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA15813;
Tue, 10 Mar 1998 17:27:27 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA29447;
Tue, 10 Mar 1998 17:27:27 -0500 (EST)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 1998 17:27:26 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: RE- Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological
In-Reply-To: <199803061031.DAA10540@listservice.net>
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Fri, 6 Mar 1998, Phil Harris wrote:
> SNIPPET 1..
[snip]
> The typical American diet contains 10 times more animal protein (as percent
> of calories) than does the typical Chinese diet. The average dietary fat
> intake in China is 15 percent of calories compared with 38 to 40 percent in
> the United States. The average consumption of dietary fiber is 33 grams a
> day in China compared with 10 to 12 grams in the United States.
Phil, thanks for posting this. I had no idea the numbers were so
extreme.
> AND..............SNIPPET 2
>
> Although the biology of the diet and disease relationship is infinitely
> complex and is easily misunderstood when interpreted in a reductionism
> manner, the main nutritional conclusion from this study is the finding that
> the greater the consumption of a variety of good quality plant-based foods,
> the lower the risk of those diseases which are commonly found in western
> countries (eg., cancers, cardiovascular diseases, diabetes). Based on these
> and other data, we hypothesize that 80-90% of all such diseases could be
> prevented before about age 90 years.
Note that this all refers to AVERAGE (MEAN) lifespan rather than
MAXIMUM lifespan. I don't think these numbers are unreasonable. I think
many of those practicing CRAN do so with their main focus on MAXIMUM
lifespan rather than MEAN lifespan, but I am more convinced that the
benefits of the latter rather than the former will follow from CRAN.
This is fine with me. With the prospects of current technology, any
years we can buy of any type will give us a better chance of surviving
to the AGE OF BIOMEDICAL DNA REPAIR.
Unfortunately, I was a meat-eater for most of my life, up until only
a few years ago. I also was an over-eater.
> of dietary fiber and legumes. Moreover, the lower the blood cholesterol,
> the lower the risk for various cancers; there is no evidence of a
> cholesterol threshold below which further decreases in disease would not
> occur.
It is also true that the leanest people are the healthiest (when
correcting for smoking and underlying disease). However, at some point
calorie restriction will begin to damage health. Similarly, at some point
cholesterol could become so low that synthesis of essential hormones
would become a problem and the cholesterol needed for cellular membranes
would be absent.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Tue Mar 10 15:41:49 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id PAA16248; Tue, 10 Mar 1998 15:41:49 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id PAA16138; Tue, 10 Mar 1998 15:41:40 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA18351;
Tue, 10 Mar 1998 17:41:07 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA00482;
Tue, 10 Mar 1998 17:41:06 -0500 (EST)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 1998 17:41:06 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: Appetite versus Hunger -- Manipulating the Drive to Eat...or Drink! (fwd)
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
This submission was sent to me only. From the wording, it seems clear
that is was intended for the CRAN listserver. They said they intended to
forward it to the list, but I never saw it arrive. So I am forwarding it
myself.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
On Sat, 7 Mar 1998, Richard & Dawn Fedorowicz wrote:
> Ben's posting was really interesting: I found eating small meals very
> frequently helps me, eating a little even when not especially hungry
> seems to prevent me wanting to 'go overboard'.
>
> I have a different problem: when socialising I find it difficult to
> restrain my drinking. My husband drinks at home in the evenings and
> weekends, is very slim and sees no reason to alter his behaviour to help
> me along. It's not possible to avoid socialising: our lifestyle demands
> that we frequently attend functions. I've tried giving up drink
> altogether and enjoying mineral water (which was refreshing and helped
> keep my head clear!) but when all around you....and so on. So often we
> get together with friends and colleagues for formal functions which I
> feel anxious about - I'm shy and rather nervous, but it's not conducive
> to good manners when meeting people, so I resort to Dutch Courage!
>
> Any ideas on coping with this? Someone out there must have experienced
> something similar...?
>
> Dawn
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Tue Mar 10 16:02:11 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id QAA25794; Tue, 10 Mar 1998 16:02:11 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id QAA25733; Tue, 10 Mar 1998 16:02:04 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA22749;
Tue, 10 Mar 1998 18:02:00 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA01485;
Tue, 10 Mar 1998 18:02:00 -0500 (EST)
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 1998 18:01:59 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: Carbohydrate binges
In-Reply-To: <199803090218.UAA27559@www.cedarnet.org>
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Sun, 8 Mar 1998, Doug Younkin wrote:
> This is one reason I do not adopt a low fat diet, especially during
> CRAN, because with fat content of meals at around 20-25%, the
> glycemic index of my meal is much lower and so the glucose and
> insulin response I experience are very gradual and I do not have
> rebound effects or cravings.
Doug,
You impress me as being one of the most successful CRAN
practitioners. Your practice seems rigorous, painless, disciplined,
effective, and with a minimum of "side effects" or failings. I would
like to hear a more detailed description of what you would eat on
a typical day -- and when you would eat it.
> By intentionally limiting consumption
> during the day, you probably do drastically lower your glucose
> levels. As soon as you eat carbohydrates, you blast your glucose up
> like a step function, and the response of your insulin soon follows
> likewise. Then as the insulin depletes your blood of glucose, you
> may experience a crash and actually need a quick fix of carbs to
> rescue your body from a hypoglycemic attack. This see-saw effect can
> be quite powerful on cravings and moods.
Are you suggesting a carbohydrate-free diet. From mid-January until
mid-February I tried to avoid all baked goods. But this meant I was eating
almost nothing but vegetables, tofu, whey protein-drink, skim milk cheese,
very high fibre cereal, lentils and some fruit. My bladder was full all
the time, it seemed. I estimated my urine to be at least 5 or 6 litres per
day, including my water-drinking. I think this was hard on my kidneys, and
I suspected that I was losing electrolytes. Carbohydrates conserve
electrolytes, I understand (although I still want to learn more about
this).
In an earlier posting I discussed some studies that showed the
insulin response to sugar, cooked starch and uncooked starch. The
response to uncooked starch is much better. As a step in that direction
I now intend to stop toasting the bread I use for my sandwiches.
I got hemorrhoids when I tried to drop cereal.
> My suggestion is to try
> raising your fat intake (seeds, nuts, nut butters, olives, canola oil
> spreads are the ones I use) to 20-25% and see what happens to your
> cravings. I still need to monitor my calorie intake because it is
> easy to consume more than my allotment much more quickly, but the
> satiation is much more evident with the higher fat intake too.
I have had a binging problem when I got some peanut butter to used
as mouse-trap bait. The calories in nuts and nut-butters seem astronomical
to me. However, I would like to hear the recipies for your spreads.
Your suggestion of olives has raised my interest, however, since it
has monosaturated fat -- not carcinogenic fat like poly-unsaturated fat or
cardiovacular-disease aggrevating fat like saturated fats. I have not been
able to find fresh olives, however. Most is packed in jars or cans with
lots of salt. I will keep looking.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Wed Mar 11 01:08:49 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id BAA24345; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 01:08:49 -0700 (MST)
Received: from monsoon.dial.pipex.net (monsoon.dial.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id BAA24330; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 01:08:47 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199803110808.BAA24330@listservice.net>
Received: (qmail 29597 invoked from network); 11 Mar 1998 08:08:52 -0000
Received: from userj842.uk.uudial.com (HELO yz34.dial.pipex.com) (194.69.110.181)
by smtp.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 1998 08:08:52 -0000
From: "Phil Harris"
To: "Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver"
Subject: low cholesterol
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 08:07:36 -0000
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
BEN BEST WROTE
SNIP
>. Similarly, at some point
cholesterol could become so low that synthesis of essential hormones
would become a problem and the cholesterol needed for cellular membranes
would be absent.From owner-cran@ListService.net Wed Mar 11 12:23:05 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id MAA27223; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 12:23:05 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id MAA24202; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 12:15:12 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA10338;
Wed, 11 Mar 1998 14:15:03 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA13092;
Wed, 11 Mar 1998 14:15:03 -0500 (EST)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 14:15:02 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: re carbo binges
In-Reply-To: <199803091123.EAA09729@listservice.net>
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Mon, 9 Mar 1998, Phil Harris wrote:
> I have found that smaller meals 5 or 6 times per day that include usually
> some lower GI food or are high fibre / pectin raw veg / fruit blends, make
> a big difference. They seem to alter the psychology as well.
> When I eat my now smaller breakfast I immediately experience sharply
> increased appetite. This lasts from 10 to 20 minutes after the breakfast.
> It is useful to remind myself during this short period that I will have
> more in a little while.
My appetite gets stimulated every time I eat -- even if I am not
especially hungry when I eat. My biggest difficulty is STOPPING eating,
rather than resist starting. Therefore, I would do better to eat one
meal daily. The only reason I eat 3 times daily (8am, 4pm and midnight)
is because I take supplements, and supplements are best absorbed with
food.
The paper entitled "The Relationship of Body Weight to Longevity
within Laboratory Rodent Species" by Donald Ingram & Mark Reynolds
(published in 1987 in EVOLUTION OF LONGEVITY IN ANIMALS, Edited by
A.D.Woodhead & K.H.Thompson) found that Every-Other-Day (EOD) ad libitum
feeding, compared to 50% Diet Restricted (RES) feeding gave greater
lifespan increase for normal mice (56% increase EOD versus
36% increase RES). It is known that for rats, single large daily meals
are more likely to result in fat storage than multiple small daily
meals, but fewer total calories are ingested with the single feeding
regimen [FEDERAL PROCEEDINGS 29:1294-1301 (1970)]. It may be that with
EOD feeding there is less total calorie intake than with RES.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Wed Mar 11 14:16:38 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id OAA13270; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 14:16:38 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id MAA01610; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 12:34:36 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA14234;
Wed, 11 Mar 1998 14:29:59 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA13983;
Wed, 11 Mar 1998 14:29:58 -0500 (EST)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 14:29:58 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: Appetite versus Hunger -- Manipulating the Drive to Eat...or Drink! (fwd)
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Sat, 7 Mar 1998, Richard & Dawn Fedorowicz wrote:
> I have a different problem: when socialising I find it difficult to
> restrain my drinking. My husband drinks at home in the evenings and
> weekends, is very slim and sees no reason to alter his behaviour to help
> me along. It's not possible to avoid socialising: our lifestyle demands
> that we frequently attend functions. I've tried giving up drink
> altogether and enjoying mineral water (which was refreshing and helped
> keep my head clear!) but when all around you....and so on. So often we
> get together with friends and colleagues for formal functions which I
> feel anxious about - I'm shy and rather nervous, but it's not conducive
> to good manners when meeting people, so I resort to Dutch Courage!
I don't drink alcohol, but my attempt to practice CRAN rigorously has
given me more understanding of what it feels like to be an alcoholic. I
think that anyone who pushes their calorie-restriction hard enough will
eventually find themselves obsessed with food, compulsive about eating
and vulnerable to binging. But maybe I'm just rationalizing.
The issues you raise are quite different, however. I have not felt
pressure to drink alcohol at social functions, or if there is such
pressure, I have no trouble resisting it. It may help that I am a
non-drinker, so I don't have to wonder about *how much* to drink.
I can easily see that the more alcohol you drink, the less will power
you would have not to drink more. I think non-drinking is the best
policy to avoid this "slipper slope".
Non-eating is not an option, however. Rationing is the second-best
option, only provided that you have the will to commit to a certain
level of consumption beforehand and to refuse to break that commitment
later.
I don't recognize the phrase "Dutch Courage". Does that mean using
alcohol to reduce nervousness?
I also have problems restraining my eating when socializing. Part of
this is because so many people like to use food for socializing. Part
of it is because so many people want to feed you as a way of "giving" or
of being a good host/hostess. But part of it is my own problem of
self-control when I am in a food-centered environment where lots of
people are eating and lots of tempting foods are there for the taking.
Avoiding these situations can be dangerous to your social life.
However, I have had some great friendships that were not so
food-centered -- people with whom socializing might mean a walk
in the park or shared constructive activities.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Wed Mar 11 16:15:44 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id QAA01593; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 16:15:44 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp1.mailsrvcs.net (smtp1.gte.net [207.115.153.30]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id QAA01562; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 16:15:38 -0700 (MST)
Received: from gte.net (1Cust16.tnt1.ontario.ca.da.uu.net [208.254.108.16])
by smtp1.mailsrvcs.net with ESMTP id RAA13504
for ; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 17:15:29 -0600 (CST)
Message-ID: <3507186B.DC7767A4@gte.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 15:04:11 -0800
From: Paul Wakfer
Reply-To: wakfer@gte.net
Organization: Full Length Life Society
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: cran@listservice.net
Subject: [Fwd: RE- Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological]
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------2D47D3A9928E6E2DC1F492B1"
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------2D47D3A9928E6E2DC1F492B1
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
The following was sent by mistake to Ben only.
--------------2D47D3A9928E6E2DC1F492B1
Content-Type: message/rfc822
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline
Message-ID: <3505CEC3.FF8868D6@gte.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 1998 15:37:39 -0800
From: Paul Wakfer
Reply-To: wakfer@gte.net
Organization: Full Length Life Society
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Ben Best
Subject: Re: RE- Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological
References:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Ben Best wrote:
> Similarly, at some point
> cholesterol could become so low that synthesis of essential hormones
> would become a problem and the cholesterol needed for cellular membranes
> would be absent.
I believe that for those without some evidence of need, the huge push to make
ones cholesterol as low as possible is a mistake. The following abstract shows
that in the very old, those with higher cholesterol have increased longevity. If
this trend is so strong in those above 85, then I suspect it is also there less
strongly at even younger ages.
Lancet 1997 Oct 18;350(9085):1119-1123
Total cholesterol and risk of mortality in the oldest old.
Weverling-Rijnsburger AW, Blauw GJ, Lagaay AM, Knook DL, Meinders AE, Westendorp
RG
Department of General Internal Medicine, Leiden University Medical Center,
Netherlands.
BACKGROUND: The impact of total serum cholesterol as a risk factor for
cardiovascular disease decreases with age, which
casts doubt on the necessity for cholesterol-lowering therapy in the elderly. We
assessed the influence of total cholesterol
concentrations on specific and all-cause mortality in people aged 85 years and
over. METHODS: In 724 participants (median
age 89 years), total cholesterol concentrations were measured and mortality risks
calculated over 10 years of follow-up. Three
categories of total cholesterol concentrations were defined: < 5.0 mmol/L,
5.0-6.4 mmol/L, and > or = 6.5 mmol/L. In a
subgroup of 137 participants, total cholesterol was measured again after 5 years
of follow-up. Mortality risks for the three
categories of total cholesterol concentrations were estimated with a Cox
proportional-hazards model, adjusted for age, sex,
and cardiovascular risk factors. The primary causes of death were coded according
to the International Classification of
Diseases (ICD-9). FINDINGS: During 10 years of follow-up from Dec 1, 1986, to Oct
1, 1996, a total of 642 participants
died. Each 1 mmol/L increase in total cholesterol corresponded to a 15% decrease
in mortality (risk ratio 0.85 [95% CI
0.79-0.91]). This risk estimate was similar in the subgroup of participants who
had stable cholesterol concentrations over a
5-year period. The main cause of death was cardiovascular disease with a similar
mortality risk in the three total cholesterol
categories. Mortality from cancer and infection was significantly lower among the
participants in the highest total cholesterol
category than in the other categories, which largely explained the lower
all-cause mortality in this category.
INTERPRETATION: In people older than 85 years, high total cholesterol
concentrations are associated with longevity owing
to lower mortality from cancer and infection. The effects of cholesterol-lowering
therapy have yet to be assessed.
-- Paul --
wakfer@gte.net Voice/Fax: 909-481-9620 Page: 800-805-2870
The Prometheus Project -- http://prometheus.morelife.org
Perfected Suspended Animation for Patient Stabilization
until Cures for Their Terminal Diseases are Available
--------------2D47D3A9928E6E2DC1F492B1--
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Wed Mar 11 18:47:07 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id SAA04442; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 18:47:07 -0700 (MST)
Received: from arl-img-9.compuserve.com (arl-img-9.compuserve.com [149.174.217.139]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id SAA04430; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 18:47:05 -0700 (MST)
Received: (from root@localhost)
by arl-img-9.compuserve.com (8.8.6/8.8.6/2.10) id UAA29677;
Wed, 11 Mar 1998 20:46:37 -0500 (EST)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 20:46:09 -0500
From: "Michael R. Edelstein"
Subject: Re: Appetite versus Hunger -- Manipulating the Drive to Eat...or Drink!
To: "INTERNET:rdf2z@koan.de"
Cc: CRAN List
Message-ID: <199803112046_MC2-366F-E9F6@compuserve.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Disposition: inline
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Dawn Fedorowicz wrote:
> I have a different problem: when socialising I find it difficult to
> restrain my drinking. My husband drinks at home in the evenings and
> weekends, is very slim and sees no reason to alter his behaviour to hel=
p
> me along. It's not possible to avoid socialising: our lifestyle demand=
s
> that we frequently attend functions. I've tried giving up drink
I've devoted a chapter in my book (see below) detailing techniques helpfu=
l =
in overcoming this problem. I'd be happy to send you a copy of the chapte=
r,
just give me your mailing address.
Michael
Michael R. Edelstein, Ph.D. =
Clinical Psychologist
San Francisco
415-673-2848 (24 hours)
Author of THREE MINUTE THERAPY: =
CHANGE YOUR THINKING, CHANGE YOUR LIFE*
(with David Ramsay Steele, Ph.D.)
FEATURES HELP FOR ANXIETY, DEPRESSION,
RELATIONSHIPS, PANIC ATTACKS AND ADDICTION
*A Quality Paperback Book Club/Book-of-the-Month Club Selection
TO ORDER: www.amazon.com
Or toll free: 1-800-986-4135
DrEdelstein@ThreeMinuteTherapy.com
www.ThreeMinuteTherapy.com
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Wed Mar 11 18:50:10 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id SAA05572; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 18:50:10 -0700 (MST)
Received: from hil-img-10.compuserve.com (hil-img-10.compuserve.com [149.174.177.140]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id SAA05521; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 18:50:01 -0700 (MST)
Received: (from root@localhost)
by hil-img-10.compuserve.com (8.8.6/8.8.6/2.10) id UAA26513;
Wed, 11 Mar 1998 20:49:30 -0500 (EST)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 20:46:04 -0500
From: "Michael R. Edelstein"
Subject: Re: Carbohydrate binges
To: Tim Freeman
Cc: CRAN List
Message-ID: <199803112046_MC2-366F-E9F1@compuserve.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Disposition: inline
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Tim Freeman wrote:
> I plan to stockpile some canned vegetables or legumes, and try
> eating them instead in these circumstances. The goal is to eat
> something that supplies enough calories to make the headache go away,
> but not something that escalates the binge.
Ready-to-eat raw baby carrots, available in virtually all supermarkets =
where I live, serves this purpose well for me.
Michael
Michael R. Edelstein, Ph.D. =
Clinical Psychologist
San Francisco
415-673-2848 (24 hours)
Author of THREE MINUTE THERAPY: =
CHANGE YOUR THINKING, CHANGE YOUR LIFE*
(with David Ramsay Steele, Ph.D.)
FEATURES HELP FOR ANXIETY, DEPRESSION,
RELATIONSHIPS, PANIC ATTACKS AND ADDICTION
*A Quality Paperback Book Club/Book-of-the-Month Club Selection
TO ORDER: www.amazon.com
Or toll free: 1-800-986-4135
DrEdelstein@ThreeMinuteTherapy.com
www.ThreeMinuteTherapy.com
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Wed Mar 11 18:50:12 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id SAA05589; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 18:50:12 -0700 (MST)
Received: from hil-img-10.compuserve.com (hil-img-10.compuserve.com [149.174.177.140]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id SAA05522; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 18:50:01 -0700 (MST)
Received: (from root@localhost)
by hil-img-10.compuserve.com (8.8.6/8.8.6/2.10) id UAA26533;
Wed, 11 Mar 1998 20:49:34 -0500 (EST)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 20:46:06 -0500
From: "Michael R. Edelstein"
Subject: Carbohydrate binges
To: Ben Best
Cc: CRAN List
Message-ID: <199803112046_MC2-366F-E9F5@compuserve.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Disposition: inline
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Ben Best wrote:
> My main problem with binging has been with carbohydrates. For someon=
e
> else this might mean cookies, but for me it has meant the complex
> carbohydrates in cooked grain foods, processed cereals and breads. I ha=
ve
> noticed that there is a whole syndrome to the binging process. It usual=
ly
> occurs in the evening, often late at night when I am already very tired=
=2E
> Perhaps my will power is weaker at that time, after a long day, and
> usually I will have eaten very little during the day. =
I have an identical problem. I deal with this by not allowing myself to e=
at
after 8PM on weekdays, and not allowing myself bread (except Lotus Bakery=
=
rye, which I'm never tempted to binge on) on weekends.
Michael
Michael R. Edelstein, Ph.D. =
Clinical Psychologist
San Francisco
415-673-2848 (24 hours)
Author of THREE MINUTE THERAPY: =
CHANGE YOUR THINKING, CHANGE YOUR LIFE*
(with David Ramsay Steele, Ph.D.)
FEATURES HELP FOR ANXIETY, DEPRESSION,
RELATIONSHIPS, PANIC ATTACKS AND ADDICTION
*A Quality Paperback Book Club/Book-of-the-Month Club Selection
TO ORDER: www.amazon.com
Or toll free: 1-800-986-4135
DrEdelstein@ThreeMinuteTherapy.com
www.ThreeMinuteTherapy.com
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Wed Mar 11 19:02:14 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id TAA10047; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 19:02:14 -0700 (MST)
Received: from galaxy.ucr.edu (root@galaxy.ucr.edu [138.23.226.100]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id TAA10024; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 19:02:11 -0700 (MST)
Received: from boyce5452.ucr.edu (boyce5452.ucr.edu [138.23.156.133])
by galaxy.ucr.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA06246
for ; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 18:02:13 -0800 (PST)
Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980311180147.007a2480@galaxy.ucr.edu>
X-Sender: browley@galaxy.ucr.edu
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32)
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 18:01:47 -0800
To: cran@ListService.net
From: Brian Rowley
Subject: [Fwd: RE- Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex
epidemiological]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Paul Wakfer wrote:
>I believe that for those without some evidence of need, the huge push to make
>ones cholesterol as low as possible is a mistake. The following abstract
shows
>that in the very old, those with higher cholesterol have increased longevity.
I've heard the same thing! Dr. Morley Sutter of UBC (Prof. Pharmacology)
told me there is a correlation between heart disease and blood cholesterol
before age 65, but an INVERSE correlation after age 65. That suggests that
linking blood cholesterol levels to heart disease etiology in any obvious
or simple-minded way is wrong.
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 12 02:13:43 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id CAA23460; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 02:13:43 -0700 (MST)
Received: from monsoon.dial.pipex.net (monsoon.dial.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id CAA23454; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 02:13:39 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199803120913.CAA23454@listservice.net>
Received: (qmail 9896 invoked from network); 12 Mar 1998 09:13:44 -0000
Received: from userj836.uk.uudial.com (HELO yz34.dial.pipex.com) (194.69.110.175)
by smtp.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 12 Mar 1998 09:13:44 -0000
From: "Phil Harris"
To: "Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver"
Subject: Re: [Fwd: RE- Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological]
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 09:12:45 -0000
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
----------
> From: Paul Wakfer
> To: cran@listservice.net
> Subject: [Fwd: RE- Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex
epidemiological]
MY comment:
Higher total cholesterol means living longer in old age?
Bad news here for CR on the face of it apparently. The total cholesterol
figures quoted for the very elderly in the Lancet study (see P's forward
attachment to his message above), tranlated into US units, are roughly 180
mg/dL upwards. This is a very different range from typical CR folk, often
around 130, and different again from those figures that tie in with the
least incidence of chronic degeneracy diseases, particularly cancer, in
China, quoted by TC Campbell: vis. 100 -125 mg/dL lifetime concentration.
BTW, however, in Western populations total cholesterol rises with age. (I
dont know about other pops.). Cancer rate also rises, accelarating
drastically in very old age. Also a recent major study, ref. not to hand
but heavily cited in med literature, of Glasgow men, showed that blanket
intervention with an effective cholesterol lowering drug lowered mortality
of middle-aged men because of lowering of deaths due to cardio-vascular.
best wishes
Phil Harris
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 12 03:01:43 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id DAA00576; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 03:01:43 -0700 (MST)
Received: from ip78.129.isdn.hogia.net (ip78.129.isdn.hogia.net [195.78.129.78]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id DAA00568; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 03:01:41 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199803121001.DAA00568@listservice.net>
Received: from 195.78.129.75 by ip78.129.isdn.hogia.net
with SMTP (QuickMail Pro Server for MacOS 1.1d1); 12 MAR 98 10:59:20 UT
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express for Macintosh - 4.0c (197)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 11:06:53 +0100
Subject: Re: Appetite versus Hunger
From: "Felix Ungman"
To: CRAN@ListService.net
Mime-version: 1.0
X-Priority: 3
Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Ben Best:
> I don't drink alcohol, but my attempt to practice CRAN rigorously has
>given me more understanding of what it feels like to be an alcoholic. I
>think that anyone who pushes their calorie-restriction hard enough will
>eventually find themselves obsessed with food, compulsive about eating
>and vulnerable to binging. But maybe I'm just rationalizing.
well, if you don't get obsessed with food on CR, you probably should
see a doctor. I find binging very annoying, but try to tackle the
problem slighty different. I don't know what "will power" is, and
I'm not sure that I have such a thing. Instead I realize that I have
several complex feedback loops, that I have very little control over.
I can choose what to eat, but can't modify how the amino acids that I
eat stimulate me. Feeling guilty of binging might work once or twice,
but in the long rung guilt is more destructive than constructive.
I believe CR should be hazzle free. It's hard, but I'm sure it's
possible.
FELIX'98 - CITIUS . ALTIUS . FORTIUS
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 12 08:33:36 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id IAA22918; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 08:33:36 -0700 (MST)
Received: from rsunx.crn.cogs.susx.ac.uk (root@rsunx.crn.cogs.susx.ac.uk [139.184.48.12]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id IAA22888; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 08:33:28 -0700 (MST)
Received: from iane.ppp.cogs.susx.ac.uk ([139.184.53.39]) [139.184.53.39]
by rsunx.crn.cogs.susx.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 1.82 #1)
id 0yD9yM-0004xP-00; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 15:32:42 +0000
Subject: Re: Carbohydrate binges
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 98 15:39:12 -0000
x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997
From: Ian Eiloart
To: "Michael R. Edelstein" ,
"Ben Best"
cc: "CRAN List"
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Message-Id:
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
>after 8PM on weekdays, and not allowing myself bread (except Lotus Bakery
>rye, which I'm never tempted to binge on) on weekends.
>
What a cool solution, only eat food that you hate! ;^)
--
cheers, Ian
http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/iane
http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/iane/coops
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 12 08:33:42 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id IAA22957; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 08:33:42 -0700 (MST)
Received: from rsunx.crn.cogs.susx.ac.uk (root@rsunx.crn.cogs.susx.ac.uk [139.184.48.12]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id IAA22871; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 08:33:25 -0700 (MST)
Received: from iane.ppp.cogs.susx.ac.uk ([139.184.53.39]) [139.184.53.39]
by rsunx.crn.cogs.susx.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 1.82 #1)
id 0yD9yJ-0004xP-00; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 15:32:39 +0000
Subject: Re: Appetite versus Hunger -- Manipulating the Drive to Eat...or Drink! (fwd)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 98 15:39:10 -0000
x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997
From: Ian Eiloart
To: "Ben Best" ,
"Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver"
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Message-Id:
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com) said:
>
>On Sat, 7 Mar 1998, Richard & Dawn Fedorowicz wrote:
>
>> I have a different problem: when socialising I find it difficult to
>> restrain my drinking. My husband drinks at home in the evenings and
>> weekends, is very slim and sees no reason to alter his behaviour to help
>> me along. It's not possible to avoid socialising: our lifestyle demands
>> that we frequently attend functions. I've tried giving up drink
>> altogether and enjoying mineral water (which was refreshing and helped
>> keep my head clear!) but when all around you....and so on. So often we
>> get together with friends and colleagues for formal functions which I
>> feel anxious about - I'm shy and rather nervous, but it's not conducive
>> to good manners when meeting people, so I resort to Dutch Courage!
>
> I don't drink alcohol,
> The issues you raise are quite different, however. I have not felt
>pressure to drink alcohol at social functions, or if there is such
>pressure, I have no trouble resisting it. It may help that I am a
>non-drinker,
Absolutely, if you have never drunk alcohol, you should have no problem,
among responsible adults. If you are an ex-drinker, it probably got
easier with time after you quit drinking.
>
> I don't recognize the phrase "Dutch Courage". Does that mean using
>alcohol to reduce nervousness?
Yes.
--
cheers, Ian
http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/iane
http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/iane/coops
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 12 08:33:52 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id IAA23040; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 08:33:52 -0700 (MST)
Received: from rsunx.crn.cogs.susx.ac.uk (rsunx.crn.cogs.susx.ac.uk [139.184.48.12]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id IAA23024; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 08:33:50 -0700 (MST)
Received: from iane.ppp.cogs.susx.ac.uk ([139.184.53.39]) [139.184.53.39]
by rsunx.crn.cogs.susx.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 1.82 #1)
id 0yD9yF-0004xP-00; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 15:32:36 +0000
Subject: Re: Appetite versus Hunger -- Manipulating the Drive to Eat...or Drink!
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 98 15:39:07 -0000
x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997
From: Ian Eiloart
To:
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Message-Id:
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Dawn Fedorowicz (rdf2z@koan.de) said:
>Ben's posting was really interesting: I found eating small meals very
>frequently helps me, eating a little even when not especially hungry
>seems to prevent me wanting to 'go overboard'.
>
>I have a different problem: when socialising I find it difficult to
>restrain my drinking. My husband drinks at home in the evenings and
>weekends, is very slim and sees no reason to alter his behaviour to help
>me along. It's not possible to avoid socialising: our lifestyle demands
>that we frequently attend functions. I've tried giving up drink
>altogether and enjoying mineral water (which was refreshing and helped
>keep my head clear!) but when all around you....and so on. So often we
>get together with friends and colleagues for formal functions which I
>feel anxious about - I'm shy and rather nervous, but it's not conducive
>to good manners when meeting people, so I resort to Dutch Courage!
>
>Any ideas on coping with this? Someone out there must have experienced
>something similar...?
>
>Dawn
>
I drink, too. I think that the evidence that alcohol is beneficial to
health is difficult to ignore. I believe that red wine is particularly
beneficial. I think that there are three considerations to help you drink
sensibly:
1. The calories in alcoholic drink come from sugars and alcohol, and a
little protein in beers and wines. Avoid drinks with high sugars, eg Port
and liqueurs such as sdvocat cherry brandy and curacao. Spirits (brandy,
gin, rum, whisky) have virtually no sugars. Sweet white wine contains 10
times more sugar than sweet white wine.
g/100ml sugar alcohol kj/100ml
Red 0.3 9.5 284 av. of Beaujolais, burgundy,
claret
Rose 2.5 8.7 294 5 different samples
dry white 0.6 9.1 275 5 diff samp
med wh 3.4 8.8 311 Graves
sparkling 1.4 9.9 315 Champagne
sweet wh 5.9 10.2 394 Sauternes
For red and dry whites,the kJ from sugars are small. A half bottle
(375ml) is about 1200kJ, about 300kc. Don't forget that your appetite
will be stimulated, and that salty foods will increase your thirst in a
viscious cycle.
2. For maximum Dutch Courage, drink alcohol at about 15-20% by volume. Eg
a strong wine, a fortified wine (sherry has much less sugar than port) or
a 1:1 mix of spirits and water or a diet mixer. I'd recommend a good
Scotch and water, or gin and diet tonic.
3. Alternate with long soft drinks.
4. Alcohol inebriation can occur as a placebo effect if you believe that
there is alcohol in an alcohol free drink. This might be a little
difficult to achieve deliberately, but you could ask your husband to help!
--
cheers, Ian
http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/iane
http://www.cogs.susx.ac.uk/users/iane/coops
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 12 13:31:51 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id NAA27508; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 13:31:51 -0700 (MST)
Received: from vcn.bc.ca (oberon@opus.vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id NAA27442; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 13:31:43 -0700 (MST)
Received: from localhost (oberon@localhost)
by vcn.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA12018
for ; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 12:31:35 -0800 (PST)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 12:31:29 -0800 (PST)
From: Doug Skrecky
To: cran@listservice.net
Subject: body fat loss with conjugated linoleic acid
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Authors
Park Y. Albright KJ. Liu W. Storkson JM. Cook ME. Pariza MW.
Institution
Department of Food Microbiology and Toxicology, University of
Wisconsin-Madison 53706, USA.
Title
Effect of conjugated linoleic
acid on body composition in mice.
Source
Lipids. 32(8):853-8, 1997 Aug.
Abstract
The effects of conjugated linoleic
acid (CLA) on body composition were investigated. ICR mice
were fed a control diet containing 5.5% corn oil or a CLA-supplemented diet
(5.0% corn oil plus 0.5% CLA). Mice fed CLA-supplemented diet exhibited 57%
and 60% lower body fat and 5% and 14% increased lean body mass relative to
controls (P < 0.05). Total carnitine palmitoyltransferase activity was
increased by dietary CLA supplementation in both fat pad and skeletal muscle;
the differences were significant for fat pad of fed mice and skeletal muscle
of fasted mice. In cultured 3T3-L1 adipocytes CLA treatment (1 x 10(-4)M)
significantly reduced heparin-releasable lipoprotein lipase activity (-66%)
and the intracellular concentrations of triacylglyceride (-8%) and glycerol
(-15%), but significantly increased free glycerol in the culture medium
(+22%) compared to control (P < 0.05). The effects of CLA on body composition
appear to be due in part to reduced fat deposition and increased lipolysis in
adipocytes, possibly coupled with enhanced fatty acid
oxidation in both muscle cells and adipocytes.
Authors
Belury MA. Nickel KP. Bird CE. Wu Y.
Institution
Department of Foods and Nutrition, Purdue University, West Lafayette, IN
47907, USA.
Title
Dietary conjugated linoleic
acid modulation of phorbol ester skin tumor promotion.
Source
Nutrition & Cancer. 26(2):149-57, 1996.
Abstract
The fatty acid derivative conjugated
dienoic linoleate (CLA) has been shown to inhibit initiation and
postinitiation stages of carcinogenesis in several experimental animal
models. The goal of the present study was to determine the role of increasing
levels of dietary CLA in mouse skin tumor promotion elicited by
12-O-tetradecanoylphorbol-13-acetate (TPA). Mice were fed control (no CLA)
diet during initiation, then switched to diets containing 0.0%, 0.5%, 1.0%,
or 1.5% (wt/wt) CLA during skin tumor promotion by TPA. Body weights of mice
fed 0.5%, 1.0%, or 1.5% CLA were similar to each other but were significantly
lower (p < 0.05) than weights of mice fed no CLA (0.0%) throughout promotion.
A reduction in papilloma incidence was observed in mice fed 1.5% CLA from
Weeks 8 to 24 compared with mice fed diets containing 0.0-1.0% CLA (p <
0.05). Twenty-four weeks after tumor promotion was begun, diets containing
1.0% and 1.5% CLA inhibited tumor yield (4.94 and 4.35 tumors/mouse,
respectively) compared with diets without CLA (0.0% CLA, 6.65 tumors/mouse, p
< 0.05) or 0.5% CLA (5.92 tumors/mouse, p < 0.05). These data indicate that
CLA inhibits tumor promotion in a manner that is independent of its
anti-initiator activity. Further studies are warranted in identifying
cellular mechanisms that are likely to be involved with the antipromoter
effects of CLA.
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 12 13:33:14 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id NAA28236; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 13:33:14 -0700 (MST)
Received: from vcn.bc.ca (oberon@opus.vcn.bc.ca [207.102.64.2]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id NAA28116; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 13:32:59 -0700 (MST)
Received: from localhost (oberon@localhost)
by vcn.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA12705
for ; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 12:32:59 -0800 (PST)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 12:32:59 -0800 (PST)
From: Doug Skrecky
To: cran@listservice.net
Subject: potassium bicarbonate reduces urinary nitrogen excretion
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Authors
Frassetto L. Morris RC Jr. Sebastian A.
Institution
Department of Medicine, University of California, San Francisco 94143, USA.
Title
Potassium bicarbonate reduces urinary
nitrogen excretion in postmenopausal women.
Source
Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism. 82(1):254-9, 1997 Jan.
Abstract
Previously we demonstrated that low grade chronic metabolic acidosis exists
normally in humans eating ordinary diets that yield normal net rates of
endogenous acid production (EAP), and that the degree of acidosis increases
with age. We hypothesize that such diet-dependent and age-amplifying low
grade metabolic acidosis contributes to the decline in skeletal muscle mass
that occurs normally with aging. This hypothesis is based on the reported
finding that chronic metabolic acidosis induces muscle protein breakdown, and
that correction of acidosis reverses the effect. Accordingly, in 14 healthy
postmenopausal women residing in a General Clinical Research Center and
eating a constant diet yielding a normal EAP rate, we tested whether
correcting their "physiological" acidosis with orally administered
potassium bicarbonate (KHCO3; 60-120
mmol/day for 18 days) reduces their urinary nitrogen loss. KHCO3 reduced EAP
to nearly zero, significantly reduced the blood hydrogen ion concentration (P
< 0.001), and increased the plasma bicarbonate concentration
(P < 0.001), indicating that pre-KHCO3, diet-dependent EAP was significantly
perturbing systemic acid-base equilibrium, causing a low grade metabolic
acidosis. Urinary ammonia nitrogen, urea nitrogen, and total nitrogen levels
significantly decreased. The cumulative reduction in nitrogen excretion was
14.1 +/- 12.3 g (P < 0.001). Renal creatinine clearance and urine volume
remained unchanged. We conclude that in postmenopausal women, neutralization
of diet-induced EAP with KHCO3 corrects their preexisting diet-dependent low
grade metabolic acidosis and significantly reduces their urinary nitrogen
wasting. The magnitude of the KHCO3-induced nitrogen-sparing effect is
potentially sufficient to both prevent continuing age-related loss of muscle
mass and restore previously accrued deficits.
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 12 18:09:39 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id SAA26059; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 18:09:39 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id QAA05094; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 16:06:29 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA01439;
Thu, 12 Mar 1998 18:06:24 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA10765;
Thu, 12 Mar 1998 18:06:23 -0500 (EST)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 18:06:22 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
Reply-To: Ben Best
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: Appetite versus Hunger -- Manipulating the Drive to Eat...or Drink!
In-Reply-To:
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Thu, 12 Mar 1998, Ian Eiloart wrote:
> I drink, too. I think that the evidence that alcohol is beneficial to
> health is difficult to ignore.
I think this is all very doubtful. Of alcohol itself, it has been
associated with elevated HDL cholesterol, but I suspect that this may
be due to reduced fat intake (see below). In any case, there are much
better ways to elevate HDL cholesterol than alcohol, including exercise,
niacin supplements and CRAN. I don't drink and my HDL/LDL ratio is
*stellar* (excellent). Alcohol is 7 calories per gram and devoid of
nutrition. Even fat, at 9 calories per gram, has some redeeming features
-- essential fatty acids, associated Vitamin E, assisted absorption of
fat-soluble vitamins, etc. I can't see any nutritional benefits to
alcohol aside from the HDL cholesterol claim.
My March 5th posting, "Fat -- simple conclusions from complex
epidemiological studies", in which I reviewed the NEW ENGLAND JOURNAL
OF MEDICINE Nurses' Health Study summary of dietary fat
[NEJM 337(21):1491-1499 (1997)] contained the following:
************************** QUOTED FROM MARCH 5TH POSTING *************
Fat intake also varied inversely with alcohol intake for all categories
of fat. This is *not* an indicator of a healthy lifestyle. More likely, it
indicates a homeostatic reduction in calories from fat to compensate for
increased calories from alcohol. This may explain the "French Paradox" of
low incidence of coronary heart disease in France if high alcohol consumption
mean fewer fats are being ingested. However, I don't drink alcohol and
I think there are better alternatives to fat-calories than alcohol-calories.
(The Honolulu Heart Study found a direct correlation between incidence of
stroke and all levels of alcohol consumption -- in contrast to other studies
which showed benefit to "moderate" alcohol consumption. There are probably
many confounding factors in these epidemiological studies which have yet
to be defined. Often, I find that the category of "non-drinker" includes
former alcoholics -- which creates a bias for the advantages of "moderate
drinking".)
************************ END OF EXCERPT FROM MARCH 5TH POSTING ***********
> I believe that red wine is particularly
> beneficial.
Phil Harris' posting of 28-October-1997 described a review of the
"Cancer Chemopreventative Activity of Resveratrol" which appeared in
SCIENCE 275:218-228 (1997). This particular phytochemical from grape skins
is probably the most popular phytochemical in the world, and I doubt that
this is because it is so superior to all the others. I get lots of
phytochemicals in my fruits, vegetables and supplements (including
grapeseed extract -- proanthrocyanadin). If resveratrol becomes
available in supplements, I may include it, but I won't be drinking
red wine to get it -- I don't think the costs are worth the benefits.
> 2. For maximum Dutch Courage, drink alcohol at about 15-20% by volume. Eg
> a strong wine, a fortified wine (sherry has much less sugar than port) or
> a 1:1 mix of spirits and water or a diet mixer. I'd recommend a good
> Scotch and water, or gin and diet tonic.
I don't want to sound moralistic! My moralistic tone, if I have one,
comes from my irritation with people "bending the facts" to rationalize
the so-called "health benefits" of alcohol. My problems with carbohydrate
binges and self-control have given me more empathy with alcoholics than
I have ever had. Will power can be tough! One more problem with alcohol,
however, is that it erodes will power. By drinking it, you are only
increasing the problem of self-control.
I hope this doesn't sound moralistic, but I have had many experiences
of social anxiety -- some very extreme. It has always been my desire to
allow myself to experience those feeling fully rather than numb them with
alcohol. Only in that way do I have a possibility about learning about
those feelings and how I can conquer them.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Thu Mar 12 23:50:36 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id XAA04238; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 23:50:36 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id XAA04232; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 23:50:34 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA12740;
Fri, 13 Mar 1998 01:50:35 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA07959;
Fri, 13 Mar 1998 01:50:34 -0500 (EST)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 01:50:34 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: [Fwd: RE- Re: Fat -- simple conclusions from complex epidemiological]
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980311180147.007a2480@galaxy.ucr.edu>
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Wed, 11 Mar 1998, Brian Rowley wrote:
> Paul Wakfer wrote:
> >I believe that for those without some evidence of need, the huge push to make
> >ones cholesterol as low as possible is a mistake. The following abstract
> shows
> >that in the very old, those with higher cholesterol have increased longevity.
>
> I've heard the same thing! Dr. Morley Sutter of UBC (Prof. Pharmacology)
> told me there is a correlation between heart disease and blood cholesterol
> before age 65, but an INVERSE correlation after age 65. That suggests that
> linking blood cholesterol levels to heart disease etiology in any obvious
> or simple-minded way is wrong.
Hundreds of studies have linked blood cholesterol with coronary heart
disease (CHD) [SCIENCE 264:532-537 (1994)], but the relationship is not a
simple one. Ratios of HDL to LDL or to total blood cholesterol have been
shown to be better predictors [CIRCULATION 67(4):730-734 (1983)].
Low-fat/High carbohydrate diets typically lower both HDL and LDL
cholesterol -- if the carbohydrate is sugar, HDL may be lowered to a
greater extent (greater risk of CHD), whereas if the carbohydrate is
starch, LDL may be lowered to a greater extent [NEW ENGLAND JOURNAL OF
MEDICINE 325(24):1740-1742 (1991)]. In some epidemilogical studies
a low level of HDL is a consistent predictor of CHD, but Latin America
and East Asia have low levels of CHD, LDL and HDL. [IBID]
These studies have not concerned themselves with a specifically
elderly population, as did the study Paul cited. However many of
the elderly are sedentary and malnourished. Low blood cholesterol
in the elderly may mean low HDL cholesterol due to lack of exercise.
Also, especially in the elderly, low blood fat or cholesterol is often
a proxy for poor diet. Deficiencies of calcium and potassium are
greater contributers to high blood pressure than is excessive fat
intake -- the greater the consumption of dairy products, the less
the likelihood of high blood pressure [SCIENCE 224:1392-1398 (1984)].
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Fri Mar 13 00:15:36 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id AAA09104; Fri, 13 Mar 1998 00:15:36 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id AAA09100; Fri, 13 Mar 1998 00:15:35 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA15575;
Fri, 13 Mar 1998 02:15:39 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA08729;
Fri, 13 Mar 1998 02:15:39 -0500 (EST)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 02:15:38 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Low Fat Diet
In-Reply-To: <199803090218.UAA27559@www.cedarnet.org>
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Sun, 8 Mar 1998, Doug Younkin wrote:
> This is one reason I do not adopt a low fat diet, especially during
> CRAN, because with fat content of meals at around 20-25%, the
> glycemic index of my meal is much lower and so the glucose and
> insulin response I experience are very gradual and I do not have
> rebound effects or cravings. By intentionally limiting consumption
> during the day, you probably do drastically lower your glucose
> levels. As soon as you eat carbohydrates, you blast your glucose up
> like a step function, and the response of your insulin soon follows
> likewise. Then as the insulin depletes your blood of glucose, you
> may experience a crash and actually need a quick fix of carbs to
> rescue your body from a hypoglycemic attack. This see-saw effect can
> be quite powerful on cravings and moods. My suggestion is to try
> raising your fat intake (seeds, nuts, nut butters, olives, canola oil
> spreads are the ones I use) to 20-25% and see what happens to your
> cravings. I still need to monitor my calorie intake because it is
> easy to consume more than my allotment much more quickly, but the
> satiation is much more evident with the higher fat intake too.
Superficially, a calorie is a calorie is a calorie, and it shouldn't
matter whether it is fat, protein, carbohydrate or even alcohol. As long
as total calories are kept low and nutrition is adequate, one should
seemingly be able to successfully practice CRAN. Although some animal
studies have indicated that high fat diets result in more body fat even
though total calories are identical to controls, a study on humans has
shown no weight gain with 70% fat in contrast to 10% fat when total
calories are kept the same [AMERICAN JOURNAL OF CLINICAL NUTRITION
55:350-355 (1992)].
However, in the above study the subjects were "forced" to consume the
diet they were given, which contained a constant calorie content
irrespective of fat content. In another study, 303 women of normal body
weight were randomly assigned to two groups, a control group which
consumed about 39% fat and an intervention group which was put on a diet
that reduced fat from 39% to 21.6% (target was 20%). After one year, the
women in the low-fat group had lost an average of 3 kg (13 pounds) and
had reduced calorie intake by 25%. The conclusion of the study was that ad
libitum consumption of high-fat foods leads to chronic excess calorie
consumption. [AMERICAN JOURNAL OF CLINICAL NUTRITION 54:821- 828 (1991)].
Your claim for greater satiety from fat is evidently not true
for most people on a per-calorie basis. I have noticed this both in
myself and also on the basis of reading weight-reduction books
which indicate that one of the common denominators of people who
lose weight and do not regain it is a reduction of the fats in
their diet. My first recommendation for anyone wanting to lose
weight or reduce calories is to stop eating meat and reduce
consumption of other fatty foods.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Fri Mar 13 04:34:47 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id EAA22531; Fri, 13 Mar 1998 04:34:47 -0700 (MST)
Received: from hertz.ukonline.co.uk (qmailr@hertz.ukonline.co.uk [195.40.112.13]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id EAA22519; Fri, 13 Mar 1998 04:34:43 -0700 (MST)
Received: (qmail 2037 invoked from network); 13 Mar 1998 11:40:10 -0000
Received: from lon8-11.ukonline.co.uk (HELO Notebook) (195.40.114.139)
by hertz.ukonline.co.uk with SMTP; 13 Mar 1998 11:40:10 -0000
Message-ID: <35098835.19F7@ukonline.co.uk>
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 11:25:51 -0800
From: Neil Kenning
Reply-To: neil.k2@ukonline.co.uk
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I; 16bit)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: CRAN@ListService.net
Subject: CR Methods: Are some methods easier than others?
References:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
Ben Best wrote:
> ...... I think that anyone who pushes their calorie-restriction
> hard enough will eventually find themselves obsessed with food,
> compulsive about eating and vulnerable to binging.
> But maybe I'm just rationalizing.
And maybe not.
Do some strategies require less thinking about than others?
Eg
(1) Intermittant fasting (1, 2 or 3 days each week)
verses
(2) An overall restriction in calories (calorie density and size) of
each meal.
Which is prefered by practictioners on this list?
Cheers
Neil
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Fri Mar 13 11:32:24 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id LAA28705; Fri, 13 Mar 1998 11:32:24 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id LAA28604; Fri, 13 Mar 1998 11:32:10 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA28949;
Fri, 13 Mar 1998 13:31:57 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA28816;
Fri, 13 Mar 1998 13:31:56 -0500 (EST)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 13:31:55 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: Appetite versus Hunger
In-Reply-To: <199803121001.DAA00568@listservice.net>
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Thu, 12 Mar 1998, Felix Ungman wrote:
> Ben Best:
> > I don't drink alcohol, but my attempt to practice CRAN rigorously has
> >given me more understanding of what it feels like to be an alcoholic. I
> >think that anyone who pushes their calorie-restriction hard enough will
> >eventually find themselves obsessed with food, compulsive about eating
> >and vulnerable to binging. But maybe I'm just rationalizing.
>
> well, if you don't get obsessed with food on CR, you probably should
> see a doctor. I find binging very annoying, but try to tackle the
> problem slighty different. I don't know what "will power" is, and
> I'm not sure that I have such a thing. Instead I realize that I have
> several complex feedback loops, that I have very little control over.
> I can choose what to eat, but can't modify how the amino acids that I
> eat stimulate me. Feeling guilty of binging might work once or twice,
> but in the long rung guilt is more destructive than constructive.
> I believe CR should be hazzle free. It's hard, but I'm sure it's
> possible.
"Calorie Restriction" is not a discrete (binary-type) entity. Calorie
intakes of 2000, 1800, 1600, 1400, 1200, 1000, 800, 600, 400, 200, and 0
calories per day will all count as Calorie Restriction. If you choose 0
you are not going to get Adequate Nutrition (calorie deficiency!) and
you will soon die. A person who practices CRAN hassle-free at 1800
calories per day might find themselves with the personality of a
heroin-junkie at 800 calories per day. That was my basic point. I
doubt that the optimum Calorie Restriction for Maximum Lifespan
in humans (an undetermined value) is within anyone's "comfort zone".
But there may be some exceptions.
Nonetheless, there are techniques that people can learn to practice
that can make a given level of CRAN more tolerable and workable. The
easiest one I know of is to minimize fat consumption. Others include
things like weighing food, rationing eating portions, only eating
certain quantities of food at certain times of day, food choices
of various kinds, avoiding being around food unnecessarily, don't
keep high-calorie foods in your kitchen, etc. I now have a target
weight of 120 pounds and my main task in the practice of CRAN is
to find ways to maintain that weight with a minimum of discomfort.
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Fri Mar 13 15:30:38 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id PAA00736; Fri, 13 Mar 1998 15:30:38 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id PAA00714; Fri, 13 Mar 1998 15:30:36 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA13133;
Fri, 13 Mar 1998 17:30:21 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA17228;
Fri, 13 Mar 1998 17:30:21 -0500 (EST)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 17:30:20 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: Low Fat Diet
In-Reply-To:
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Fri, 13 Mar 1998, Ben Best wrote:
> women in the low-fat group had lost an average of 3 kg (13 pounds) and
^^^^^^^^^
OOPS!! Make that 6.6 pounds!
-- Ben
--------------------------------------------
Ben Best (benbest@benbest.com)
http://www.benbest.com/
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Sun Mar 15 03:44:47 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id DAA22044; Sun, 15 Mar 1998 03:44:47 -0700 (MST)
Received: from monsoon.dial.pipex.net (monsoon.dial.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id DAA22039; Sun, 15 Mar 1998 03:44:44 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199803151044.DAA22039@listservice.net>
Received: (qmail 21820 invoked from network); 15 Mar 1998 10:44:42 -0000
Received: from userb525.uk.uudial.com (HELO yz34.dial.pipex.com) (193.149.82.254)
by smtp.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 1998 10:44:42 -0000
From: "Phil Harris"
To: "Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver"
Subject: Re: Low Fat Diet and cholesterol
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 1998 10:43:34 -0000
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
While tidying came across extracts from Science 272 685-688, 3 May 1996, JL
Breslow: Mouse Models of Atherosclerosis. Page 686, quote:-
"One of the hallmarks of atherosclerosis is its exacerbation by
high-cholesterol, high-fat diets. This effect is mimicked in apo-E
deficient mice ( Nakashima Y et al., Aretioscler. thromb. 14, 133 (1994)).
When these mice were fed a Western-type diet (containing 0.15% cholesterol
and 21% fat, derived from mainly milk fat), their cholesterol levels rose
to three to four times the levels of the low-cholesterol, low-fat diet, and
their lesions increased in size and rate of progression."
My understanding is that their are 'high-responders' to dietary cholesterol
in the human population. For them, cholesterol-free (no animal product)
low-fat diet could be wise. Not sure what is the basis of above
percentages, but general point seems well made.
Also interesting article in same Science, page 682, discusses arrhythmia
"...can also be acquired. ...side effects...most of these medications block
HERG channels..... observation provides a mechanistic link between an
inherited and an acquired arrhythmia......[potassium supplementation]
therapy likely to be effective in all acquired and inherited forms of
LQT...."
Phil Harris
>From owner-cran@ListService.net Sun Mar 15 10:57:56 1998
Received: (root@localhost) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id KAA20419; Sun, 15 Mar 1998 10:57:56 -0700 (MST)
Received: from smtp.interlog.com (root@smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by listservice.net (8.8.5) id KAA20412; Sun, 15 Mar 1998 10:57:54 -0700 (MST)
Received: from shell1.interlog.com (benbest@shell1.interlog.com [207.34.202.8])
by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA01406;
Sun, 15 Mar 1998 12:57:39 -0500 (EST)
Received: (from benbest@localhost)
by shell1.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA14388;
Sun, 15 Mar 1998 12:57:34 -0500 (EST)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 1998 12:57:34 -0500 (EST)
From: Ben Best
X-Sender: benbest@shell1.interlog.com
To: Caloric Restriction with Adequate Nutrition Listserver
cc: Ben Best
Subject: Re: Caloric Restriction Does not Slow Aging in Humans
In-Reply-To:
Message-ID:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Sender: owner-cran@ListService.net
Precedence: bulk
On Wed, 25 Feb 1998, Ben Best wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Feb 1998, Doug Skrecky wrote:
>
> > Recent evidence indicates that the anti-aging effect of caloric
> > restriction, which has been documented in rodents, is not operative in
> > humans.
>
> > A low body-mass index does have a positive association with reduced
> > mortality rates in humans. However recent research indicates that this is
> > due to a negative association between BMI and physical fitness. After
> > physical fitness is accounted for, there exists no further effect of BMI
> > on mortality. See the following table from (International Journal of
> > Obesity 19 Suppl: S41-S44 1995.
Now that I have read this article, I have nothing to add to my
previous critique -- it seems right on target. Except to note that your
reference was incomplete. You should have noted that the article you
were citing was from Volume 19 *Supplement 4* of 1995. By not giving
the supplement number you delayed my ability to get a copy of this
article by a week.
> > In humans over 84 years of age BMI has not been found to ex